海外留学者　ｖｓ　国内英語学習者

>>946
I decide to pick up the language quite seriously and not to hang
around with other Japanese before I went to an English speaking
country... but my homesickness was more severe(severer?) than
I had expected. I did hang around with my Japanese friends more
frequently than necessary... That's why my English never got to
the level I wanted it to be. Did I waste my time by not making
the best advantage of the opportunity I was given?
Yes and no. I had a good time, apart from being homesick.
I learned some English, with which I can get things done.
またまたへたくそスマン。

>>951
a banana でなくて bananas

「〜好む」という場合、例えば
I like an apple でなく I like apples と複数で言うのが普通ということ。

fruit flies like bananas　になるってことですよ。>>951

>>946
なんか基本的な部分を抜かして解釈しているように思えるのだが。
Ordinary people → Ordinary people who wants to learn another languageでしょ。

>>953　あ　スマン同レスしてしまった

>>956
いえ、勝手に代弁して失礼。

>>955

私には、
Ordinary people → Ordinary people who cannot be like ◆BnNJsMYZJo
と映るのですが・・・。どうなんでしょ。

>>958
そうなのか。難しいね。

>>955　因みにpeopleは複数ね(are)

>>960
なんで俺だけpick on meしますか。
チューコク人とおもてパカにしてるありますか。

>>960

鋭いなあ。ひょっとして上級者の方ですか？

それに>>938>>952は｢下手でスマン｣って書きながらも英語で書いている。
この人に対して細かい指摘はしなくてもいいんじゃないかなぁ...大きな間違いでもない限り。
それに、文の内容からordinary peopleが何を指しているか解る。

>>963
同意。

>>961チューコク人とおもってバカにしてないけど、955に代わってレスするのはやめよう。あんまり面白くない。

>>963
つーか、 Ordinary people should go to a country　→　result in an increase of
stupid Japanese students who not even try to learn English and just hanging
around with their Japanese friendsという論理に飛躍、というか、本気で勉強したい
普通の人だったら、そんなことにナル可能性は低いんじゃないかということをいいたかった
んだけどな。英語について指摘してるわけじゃないよ。

そっか、それはスマンかった。>>958もみたので英語の指摘だと思ってしまった>>966

>>966

>本気で勉強したい普通の人だったら、
そんなことにナル可能性は低いんじゃないかということをいいたかった

Ordinary peopleが「本気で勉強したい普通の人」なの？

>>968
What I meant by ordinary people was those who are not so talented
in languages as the guy who mastered English only in Japan...

>>969

That means, you meant by the words, " ordinary people", were those who are not
so talented in languages as the guy who mastered English only in Japan, but people who want to
study hard in English... Is that right?

>>970
話の流れからすると、そう思ったんだけど。

nit-pick好きですねぇ、、、

nit-pickなのか？

>>969
I meant by "the ordinary people" those not so talented in
languages as to be able to master English or other foreign
languages while living exclusively in Japan.

>>898
>Rather, it was about the higher degree of efficiency in learning English abraod.

It depends on how you learn English in Japan. Some people seem to learn
English much faster in Japan than those who learn English in English-speaking countries.

Also, English learners in Japan may not necessarily waste their time
studying English because they could learn a lot of other things while
learning English.

For example, I learned a lot about phonetics while I was practicing
my English pronunciation. I also read a lot of novels and short
stories in English. I learned a lot about science, too, because I
read a lot of college science textbooks. Reading English-language
newspapers and magazines expanded my knowledge of the world as well.

>>836
Improving pronunciation involves a huge amount of listening activities.
So you could say my listening ability is very high.
I can understand English-language broadcasts and movies very well.
I haven't had any problems speaking with people from different areas
of English-speaking countries yet unless they speak English with a strong accent.

じゃ、>>969と９７４はどっちが本物なの？

>>970
Some people have a genious for learning a foreign language.
They master it no matter what...regardless of how limited their
exposure to the language might be. Some things which are true
with those very talented people are not necessarily true with
those who are not as gifted and who don't want to spend so much
time and who want to use a short-cut, by which I mean "going abroad
and pick up a language while living there."
またもや意味をなさないか？スマン。

>>976
974は969のnit pickingじゃろ。

>>974
Thank you for correcting my poor English.

>>976
As a matter of fact, I'm not #969.
>>978
Do you understand the word, sir?

ＯＢの I have a friend of mine が普通の表現とかの論調を
見ると、日本で学習してる方がマシなような気がするのも
分からないでない。

でもＯＢはＯＢだからな（ｗ

A definite advantage of learning English in Japan is that it costs
much less money than learning English in an English-speaking country.
I spent only 100,000 yen or so on the study of English.
You probably have to spend about 3,000,000 yen a year if you study
English in an English-speaking country. I doubt whether the
result is really worth that much money.

Will someone create Part 2 of this thread?

いや、あなたの言おうとしている事はあなたのどの文章を読んでも明確ですよ。
ただ、それに対するレスが少し独断的なのでordinary peopleが誰のことを指しているのかが問題になってるんです。
あなたが言う通り、国内で上級レベルの英語を取得できる方々に才能があるのは言うまでもありません。
比較的楽に英語を上達したい人は海外に英語を学びに行った方が能率的なことも。>>946が少しおおげさにそれを受け取っただけだと思います。

>>977

>>982
I agree if the sole purpose of going abroad is to learn English.
If one is to go abroad and just attend English language school,
what he gains from the experience may not be cost-effective.

However if one is to attend a university and graduate with a major in
something, he would be learning much more than just English language.
In this case, I would say the money is worth spending. Wouldn't you
agree?

>>977

I understand what you meat to say I totally agree with you that Japanese people
who are not so talented in language skill should go to abroad in order to learn English.
I tottaly agree with you on that point.

However, what I'm trying to say is that Japanese people
should go to abroard for studying English only if they have their distination or some kind of goals.
.Otherwise, they never be able to learn English in the other countries..

In your case, it seems to me that you had gotten some kind of goals before you went to abroad, say,
"I wanna be a good English speaker" or something, right? That's one of the great goals (or motivations).
That's not bad at all. Therefore, you became a good English writer (speaker).

>>986
>However if one is to attend a university and graduate with a major in
>something, he would be learning much more than just English language.
>In this case, I would say the money is worth spending.

I agree with you on that point, especially if tuition is free.

>>986
It's getting more and more trendy to go abroad for a few weeks attending
a language school in the morning and sight-seeing in the afternoon.
It comes between studying abroad and sightseeing. On a study tour like
that, you don't learn a lot. It's not cost effective...
But even as it is, it's still better than nothing. If you can
afford to do that, why not?

>>989
I forgot to add へたくそ英語スマン

誰か次スレ立ててくれんかの・・・。

やっぱりＰタンがいるような気がするなあ。

次スレ
http://academy2.2ch.net/test/read.cgi/english/1083598994/

Sorry to butt in from the side. I'm >>846>>898.
>>987 Your argument seems to be getting narrower and narrower -
in fact, as narrow as those who go abroad to study English without a goal of some kind.
And exactly why would these kind of people matter? I'm doubting the validity of your argument.

>>988◆BnNJsMYZJo Can I just ask you one question to which the answer seems obvious but nevertheless important?
You are the proof for all your claims, am I right?

Fill out!

>>987
I agree with you. It is not cost effective to go on a study tour
like I said in >>989.
While I was doing a course in an English speaking country, I saw a
lot of the girls(not many boys...come to think of it, it's funny)
who take a study tour without any specific motivations or anything.
They asked me to say things to their home-stay parents on behalf
of them. They didn't even want to fix things by themselves...
I doubt if they wanted to try their English.
It's a waste of money if you don't want to use your English...
Anyway I am not a good speaker as you kindly said. My English
is just good enough to get by in an English speaking country.
通じないことが多かったですがね。

Fill this out.

あれっ？

In my opinion, foreign language learning is more or less meaningless
if you cannot reach a high level of proficiency. Most students studying
English in English-speaking countries do not reach that level, and they
soon forget English.

Also I think that the idea that people who are not talented enough to
learn English in Japan can learn English in an English-speaking country
is a myth. Most of these people cannot learn English no matter where they study.

However, some of them may be able to learn English if they change methods of learning.
In most cases, these people haven't tried the direct method yet.
So they should try it. If the direct method does not work, then they
should find a better teacher or school who uses it. If nothing works,
they had better give up. It would be a waste of time and money for
them to go to an English-speaking country to continue their study.

Is this the last one?

このスレッドは１０００を超えました。
もう書けないので、新しいスレッドを立ててくださいです。。。